Max Hardcore Jailed for 46 months !

[hardware]

Yeah, but I doubt "Max" is taking any solace in the fact that BushCo is such a fuck-up.

[sbando]

Mine was a reply to this .

...the administration wants to destroy all porn in the U.S... With the administration having just a mere 3 months left in office, porn is still very much alive.

Comedy!

[just_me]

I didn't mean to take this into a political discussion.

What I should have instead written in regards to this particular court case is - first while I'm not sure what level of the judicial system this trial was in - most judges are publicly elected officials and the 12 jurors were each interviewed and approved of by the defense attorney. Any conviction must be a unanimous decision. The jury has the power to go against the the law and set precedence. And in the U.S., precedence is more powerful than law. Summed up, yes, those 12 defense-approved jurors *can* nullify law.

While the administration may have landed him in the courtroom, it is absolutely ridiculous to pin the conviction on the administration.

None of us know what went on inside the courtroom, but it was enough for 12 jurors to unanimously find him guilty. And I am sure he will now be appealing the decision.


So let's just get back to looking at naked girls

[sbando]

Oh yeah, naked chicks.

Still don't know what that revolting bastard got jailed for.

[hardware]

What I should have instead written in regards to this particular court case is - first while I'm not sure what level of the judicial system this trial was in - most judges are publicly elected officials and the 12 jurors were each interviewed and approved of by the defense attorney.

Since the law Little was convicted of violating was transportation of obscene material, I assume it was in Federal court.

Also, it overstates the case to say that the defense attorney approved of the jury. Each side only gets to reject a certain number of potential jurors, otherwise they'd be tied up forever angling for the perfect jury.

[Vulture]

I've read a bit about this and I think his undoing was mailing DVDs to Florida, where the obscenity laws are rigid. Seems he didn't do his homework or threw caution to the wind. I couldn't care less. He's a vile character and bad for the industry.

My experience with his work is much the same as many here. I've a DVD somewhere with a scene of a girl saying "That hurts" while being sodomized and it's just impossible to tell if she means it or is being asked to say it for the viewer's gratification, although my instinct and her general nervousness makes me think the former. Either way, vile.

There's always a few hysterical sorts who'll say "Oooh but who next" etc. I don't feel like that. I don't think it's in the interests of even a very right wing government to go after moderate, sensible, law-abiding porn makers in a liberal society. You're just risking bad feeling and for what net result? Porn will be fine. Shed no tears for this idiot.

[hardware]

Um... "who's next" is John Stagliano. Are you putting him in the same category of deserving whatever the government does to him, which, at the very least, will be costing him a great deal of money?

Maybe you should take another look at BushCo's abuses of office over the last eight years. I'm never sanguine about what people with that much ego and power get up to.

[Xenomorgue]

Um... "who's next" is John Stagliano. Are you putting him in the same category of deserving whatever the government does to him, which, at the very least, will be costing him a great deal of money?

Well, obviously when you are the CEO of a porn company there are pros and cons associated with having your headquarters in the USA. I can only assume that John Stagliano has weighed his options carefully, and that staying in the USA was for him preferable to moving to (e.g.) Europe.

Yes, his prosecution is unfortunate. However it must be seen in the American context, which includes factors such as:
* prevalent conservative Christian morals and values
* hyprocrisy surrounding sex and pornography
* oldfashioned ideas about right and wrong, crime and punishment
* the election and re-election of George Bush
* changes in the approach towards obscenity prosecutions
* can one minimize the risk of an obscenity prosecution?
* the length and costs of legal procedures

Since EBI is a European forum, it is not meaningful to discuss these matters here. In fact, Sbando would probably be against such discussions since they can easily become (too) political.

The bottom line is that John Stagliano is an American pornographer, who is being prosecuted in the USA for breaching American laws.

[camaban]

Um... "who's next" is John Stagliano. Are you putting him in the same category of deserving whatever the government does to him, which, at the very least, will be costing him a great deal of money?

Well, obviously when you are the CEO of a porn company there are pros and cons associated with having your headquarters in the USA. I can only assume that John Stagliano has weighed his options carefully, and that staying in the USA was for him preferable to moving to (e.g.) Europe.

Yes, his prosecution is unfortunate. However it must be seen in the American context, which includes factors such as:
* prevalent conservative Christian morals and values
* hyprocrisy surrounding sex and pornography
* oldfashioned ideas about right and wrong, crime and punishment
* the election and re-election of George Bush
* changes in the approach towards obscenity prosecutions
* can one minimize the risk of an obscenity prosecution?
* the length and costs of legal procedures

Since EBI is a European forum, it is not meaningful to discuss these matters here. In fact, Sbando would probably be against such discussions since they can easily become (too) political.

The bottom line is that John Stagliano is an American pornographer, who is being prosecuted in the USA for breaching American laws.

Hell, I love living in Europe, the American way is simply not mine.

What I will never understand is that violence in movies is accepted but you can't show bare nipples in TV. Just red a few weeks back that a new spot with Eva Mendes for Calvin Klein is censored because of that. And when I thought back to the Janet Jackson "nipple scandal"

Sexually there's not much freedom in the States! And I think it"s not a good choice for a porn company to reside in the USA, that's in the end maybe the big fault John Stagliano has made.

[hardware]

What I will never understand is that violence in movies is accepted but you can't show bare nipples in TV.

The rationalization is that so long as the people who are committing the violent acts are punished at the end of the movie morality is upheld.

[Vulture]

The rationalization is that so long as the people who are committing the violent acts are punished at the end of the movie morality is upheld.

I don't think that's the rationale at all. That isn't even true in a lot of instances (take your typical "anti-hero" flick). The rationale is that screen violence isn't real, whereas sex acts in pornography are. Someone like Max Hardcore can hardly claim "artistic licence".

[LoveAvenue]

What I will never understand is that violence in movies is accepted but you can't show bare nipples in TV.

The rationalization is that so long as the people who are committing the violent acts are punished at the end of the movie morality is upheld.

well there are plenty of violent movies where that is not done

[hardware]

You should go look up 'rationalize' in the dictionary.

[Xenomorgue]

In American movies and television, morality is being upheld by letting the GOOD guys defeat the BAD guys.

It is convenient that the American public will always identify the US military, the FBI, the CIA etc as agents of GOOD. So in a police series or in a war movie you can quickly go to the core action. Some enemy carries out acts of violence, and thus the perpetrators are agents of EVIL. The vigilant US authorities (reluctantly!!) respond with their own acts of violence to destroy the enemy.

[In the movie "Dances with Wolves" the Sioux Indians play the role of the GOOD guys and the US military the BAD guys. This is a break with tradition. As can be seen in the review section of Amazon USA, there are many American viewers who dismiss the movie for this very reason.]

In everyday life there is no such thing as good or evil. That is why in most movie genres a lot of time is invested in SPINNING the story. For example, consider this script. A boy rapes a girl. The boy is acquitted as the result of a legal error. The mother of the girl shoots the boy dead. The mother is charged with murder. We have two perpetrators: a rapist boy (dead) and a murderous mother. There are victims on both sides and many relatives who are hurt. The SPIN that is given is that the girl and her parents are the ideal American family, Brady Bunch style. While the boy and his family are rich and arrogant and brutal. By creating this context the rape of the girl should be seen as an EVIL act, and the shooting dead of the boy is a RIGHTEOUS act of vengeance, for which the mother should be acquitted.

[Billbo]

You need to remember that when Clinton fired those 83 Federal prosecutors and placed people loyal to him personally in those positions, it's caused no end of problems. Those 83 were people were not the most principled people that the legal system has seen. A number have been removed for breaking the law. Many have political aspirations. If going after porn will get them votes when they run for office in the Senate or Congress, then they will do exactly that. That is the main reason this is happening. Take a closer look at which Federal prosecutors are bringing the charges.

Actually, only 30% of the U.S. is now practicing Christian, so one cannot blame them, any more than the Jews were to blame for anything that happened in Germany, Rumania, Bulgaria or Hungary when the Axis was gleefully blaming the Jews for everything and slaughtering them in the 1930s and 1940s. Only some 40 to 50% of Americans even get involved in voting, which is sheer stupidity, so one CAN blame the 50 to 60% that don't vote. 85% of the media (17 of the 20 main media outlets), including the main networks, are now owned by the international socialist Democrat Party and so almost all news from the U.S. shows this bias. In fact, this year has been described as the year that the media died-- our newspapers now are reminiscent of the articles I read from TASS and Pravda as a kid during the bad old days of the Soviet empire. And when I used to listen to Radio Moscow and Radio Kiev in high school.

I don't know anything about Mr. Little, but it's not uncommon for pornographers to break the law. So, the question is, did he break the law, or is this a political stunt by the Democrat prosecutor, in order to gain support for a run for office? Unfortunately, the latter is becoming all too common and I firmly believe that a prosecutor that breaks the law should have the same penalty that his would-be victim would have- year for year.